I appreciate your position. And I totally agree that there may, ...nay, ...will be be issues that that shoukld be restyricted to the Owner's Association member's. I believe I had already stated that in my original offer.
Still, the offer is there if you want to make use of it. And there is no time limit on it. And it need not have anything to do with anything that has previously transpired, in public forums'.
Good luck Straw, with everything you have on your plate!
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Maverick Model Yachting - The Only Way To Go! Secret Alias - Don Leitis
Don, I have been considering your suggestion again and after discussion with my fellow executive, it would appear that the added workload would be too great to set upo something on our website and something along the lines of what you suggest may well be a good idea.
Although I have always been happy to have what we are trying to achieve with the AEC12OA, open to all interested people, there are times where specific discussion is best left to members dialogue. May I ask for a rain check on this suggestion for the moment while we consider the idea further? I will get back to you in due course.
Steve , we are only in preliminary mode at present and still await the pleasure of ARYA and their decision regarding our OA taking control of the day to day business of the class.
However you have touched on a subject that is in our minds and will be addressed in due course. The deck is being considered right now and will be capable of supporting both internal and external winching and sheeting depending on the preference of the customer. I suggest you ring me directly when you get a chance so that I can better appraise you of what we have in mind.
Something You, Mr Morris & Mr West perhaps should get together to overcome
Interesting comment - truth is we HAVE sat down face to face and continue to communicate between us. The best solution is for the 3 main players - US, AUS and NZ to all be on the same page for rules which then with the other minor countries involved allows a true International status to be obtained furtehr cementing the class on the world stage.
Wiyhout this progression this will not happen so, yes I do support Peter Morris but more so I support the AEC12OA moving forward.
Sits down, grabs beer and waits for next enthralling piece of diatribe.
What ever happened to moving on and moving forward. Constitutions are adn should always be a living document updated and amended to suit current and future developments and needs. We are in an age of movement and progression - not stuck in the dark ages.
The gutless wonder strikes again, unable, or morelikely, wants to hide in annonominity so he can rubbish any item of interest to the majoriety of veiwers and destroy radio sailing to any viewer who reads his rants. Changing your sign in name freddy or wa or what ever you will call your self next doesn't change your bile.Donc
OK let me say that a little bird has just whispered in my ear that Freddy alias WA Boaats is none other than our old friend John Flahive who indicated to me and us a little over one month ago that he was retiring from discusssion on here and elsewhere, of matters related to EC12.
What has happened John to your commitment to silence and concern yourself only with matters MM exclusively? If I am correct and it is truly you as my little bird reliably informs me then henceforth I shall not respond to any further criticism and supply any further oxygen to this type of debate or discussion.
John your behaviour is akin to a small child with a stick that keeps prodding at a dangerous organism until it finally rounds on you. If I had been aware as to whom I was addressing I would not have bothered to reply. You unfortunately are attempting to take this forum back to where it was before Don cleaned it up.
Up until now I had been content to allow this forum of Don's to continue to support legitimate and constructive debate on matters EC12 but this has proved to me once and for all that unless we can have stronger administration in the vetting process as to who is considered a fit and proper person to be allowed to post on here, then unfortunately I am out of here henceforth and I will immediately start the process of establishing a forum on our own website that we shall vet fairly and impartially but at the same time confining discussion to people who are a bit more positive.
Straw
-- Edited by Straw on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 12:41:23 PM
Hello Freddy, as I have not heard of or dealt with you before, let me provide you with some hard facts and perhaps after hearing that you may care to cut us on the executive of AEC12OA some slack? I do not know whether you are a member or not of the OA so it would seem polite if you would identify yourself as I see that you have hidden your identity on this forum. How is it that you make accusations about our membership? How do you know who they are in order to cast these aspertions anyway?
There is no list of members that has been provided to the member base and the only thing that has been sent out was an email from our treasurer/webmaster David Hill yesterday that displayed all recipients. I have since councilled David not to do this in future in order to protect people's privacy. That message was a simple communication indicating the address of our new OA website to all owners and interested parties that do not necessarily own a boat but who are interested in our progress nevertheless. So if you are using that list of names in order to back up your argument and accusation that we are somehow acting unconstitutionally, then knock yourself out.
Firstly, the fact that we are in consultation with ARYA at this present point in time does not necessarily equate to our tacit approval of that organization and its apparent dysfunctional ways in recent years. God knows I am no fan of Ken Dobbie et al and I have made no secret of my criticism of him in his capacity of secretary of that body. He has made life for us in the OA "hell on wheels" and it has been an ongoing battle with him for almost 2 years of my life!!!
It is true that at times in my frustration and disappointment that I have felt like dropping the ball and simply saying, "stuff it" and go sailing and let the chips fall where they may. But then I would consider the other people behind me who had backed me with their moral support and their money and I could not find it within myself to let people down.
The pursuit of this OA agenda has cost me personally and at times it has been really rough. It has cost me personal relationships with men that I once got on with well, such has been the intensity of the process at times.Although galling this has only forced me onwards to the ultimate goal of achieving complete autonomy of the class from the dead hand of ARYA and I am pleased to say that the recent change in the executive of ARYA gives me hope that that body will slowly but surely improve and start to perform its proper function of correctly promoting radio sailing.
When I look back on what has been achieved thus far and on which I will be reporting to the members about shortly , I surprise even myself. Despite your accusations of betrayal, we can accurately report that we are a cohesive and solidified class now and just simply waiting to grow our numbers. To do that we need boats and the where with all to do that has been achieved with the new American Standard mould sitting here waiting to go into production. That cannot happen until we get total control of our class out of ARYA hands and a complete revamp of the rule base to allow that new boat to go into production.
Your comments about the constitution are unfounded as the original constitution was a simple template that was adopted at that time to get the OA up and running quickly in order to prove to Dobbie that we had the overwhelming majority of boat owners as members in order to force his hand to concede that we were not just a handfull of dysfunctional, ARYA hating, rabble, but indeed passionate owners of a beautiful class of boat that was being ignored and hung out to dry and we were not prepared to cop that any more!
Having said that, if you check the record you will find that I have always resisted the "lets go it alone" brigade and council along those lines. I realized that it was important that however dysfunctional ARYA may have been, it was important that our class remain under the umbrella of that organization if only to take advantage of the insurance cover that ARYA offer Australia wide. I came to the conclusion that Dobbie would not last forever in the secretary role and its regretable in my opinion that he remains in some sort of quasi secretary's role as we speak and remains hostile in my view to what we are trying to achieve. The man has offered absolutely nothing to help us during this process except come up with road block after road block that has delayed and frustrated the process, presumably in the vain hope that I and the OA would go away. He did not reckon on me!
So now we are at the point of liasing with the likes of Lindsay Walker and Bill Clancey who I know personally and these guys are true progressives and enthusiasts of the sport who I suspect have recognized that there was a chronic malaise at the top of radio sailing in this country and are prepared to do something about it.
So we are playing ball so to speak and attempting to cooperate in a constructive way with ARYA because with the changing of the guard I see the potential for big changes within ARYA so that it will become an asset to the sport rather than a burden as it has been for us in the OA under Dobbie and co for many years
We have had to rewrite our constitution in order to have it accurately reflect the true aims and objectives. That includes necessitating the various levels of membership, identifying voting rights within the varying membership levels, how a member can join and be ejected and all those detailed aspects of an organization such as ours. This is nothing more than us playing catch up with what is essentially filling in the gaps of what we had originally used as our constitutional base. We are entitled to vary our constitution from time to time as is any incorporated entity. In any case the final draft will be going out to all voting members shortly for their consideration and vote.
Finally as a further example of the strategy of attempting to work with ARYA as being productive, we can see now that we have got sanction to run the Morgan Black regatta in 2013 and with the exception of a few tweaks of the NOR to be performed, that regatta is a done deal. That regatta I can safely say would not be happening unless the OA had come into existance and we owners had organized ourselves into a formidable self interested group.
So as you can see we are achieving positive things and it is a pity that you and people like you can only find fault and cast accusations and negative waves out there when really if you were genuinely pro EC12 then you would be more supportive and be prepared to help instead of snipe.
I am aware that there are a handful of disgruntled non members out there and presumably you are one of them when one picks up on the tone of your post, however yours is just a very small voice when it comes right down to it and you know why?......................you and people like you offer nothing. You are not positive in your thinking................you don't help..................you see nothing but negativity............................you seek to simply tear down. Can you demonstrate something..anything.......that you have personally done for this class other than self serving your own interest? Can you identify what the motivation for your attack in your post is and what you hope to achieve by doing that? Is it you intention to destroy the AEC12OA or just me?
Why don't you grow a pair and come out truthfully and identify yourself and divulge your true agenda? It never ceases to amaze me how accurate the saying is that says "20% of the people doing 80% of the work"!
Straw
-- Edited by Straw on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 04:08:49 PM
Hi Don and thanks for the offer. We are considering this aspect of communication with our members and have been thinking if it is feasible to create a forum on our own website. We are told this is possible and if relatively straight forward to do, then we will procede to effect this. However we will keep our options open and may take you up on this offer if the alternatives end up in the "too hard" basket. I will let you know.
I look forward to receiving my copy for scrutiny...
Straw, just for further information, if it suits the AEC12OA better, there is a facility within these forums' to create a forum for members only.
Can you please let me know if you believe it would be beneficial to the sport to create this member's only forum?
But might I cautiously suggest that this forum, if desired, be restricted to technical items, such as sailing rules, committee activities, etc, rather than just everything related to EC12's being posted there, for there may be many potential EC12 sailors out there, who are very interested in the EC12 activities in this country, but who are unsure as to whether they are ready to be a member of the AEC12OA.
Don
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Maverick Model Yachting - The Only Way To Go! Secret Alias - Don Leitis
To all members, please be informed that I shall be communicating formally with you all by providing a written update of the current state of play of our owners association and the specifics of the application to ARYA under its new national class association policy. I anticipate that this communication will be sent within the next week or two after we receive the ARYA's determination of same.
Currently the new formal draft of our OA constitution is lodged with ARYA for ratification and as soon as we in your executive receive a response from that body (in the affirmative) we will be providing a copy of the new constitution to all members for their scrutiny, discussion and an indication of their acceptance or otherwise via a ballot prior to final lodgement to the Department of Fair Trading.
